Interesting Design Choices

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Posted 2:44pm on Mon 24 January 2011
dav2612
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Interesting Design Choices
Interesting Design Choices. Also know as What the Feck We You Thinking?

We must all, at some point, come across something in a game which makes you wonder how it made it past the design stage. Some decisions you can't even begin to understand how anyone could have ever thought it might be a good idea.

From playing Enslaved last week I see that checkpoints before unskippable cutscenes are somehow still kicking about despite years of complaints.

But my clear winner is Gran Turismo on the PSP. The design of this game is simply baffling.

Like Gran Tursimo 5, the PSP game was hardly a rush job but somehow they forgot to actually include the game. It's more like a an interactive tool for car collecting.

The familiar tracks are present, the cars are all present, the challenges are all present, it plays and controls like a Gran Turismo game should but the career mode stalled and didn't make it to the starting line.

The license tests this time around are just challenges, there are no licenses in this version. You can go through all the tests to prove you can drive, prove you can brake at speed and prove you know how to corner but then all you have left to do is collect cars and beat your own times. The career mode has been replaced by single races which allow you to gain some more in-game currency to buy another car for some pretty much pointless racing. It just feels so meaningless.

The time trials hold little interest since you are only beating your own times. There is nothing really to strive towards, there seems to be very little purpose. It might not be so bad if they incorporated an online element but that seems to be missing too.
Posted 7:37pm on Mon 24 January 2011
Woffls
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In response to Topic
Interesting Design Choices. Also know as What the Feck We You Thinking?

We must all, at some point, come across something in a game which makes you wonder how it made it past the design stage. Some decisions you can't even begin to understand how anyone could have ever thought it might be a good idea.

From playing Enslaved last week I see that checkpoints before unskippable cutscenes are somehow still kicking about despite years of complaints.

But my clear winner is Gran Turismo on the PSP. The design of this game is simply baffling.

Like Gran Tursimo 5, the PSP game was hardly a rush job but somehow they forgot to actually include the game. It's more like a an interactive tool for car collecting.

The familiar tracks are present, the cars are all present, the challenges are all present, it plays and controls like a Gran Turismo game should but the career mode stalled and didn't make it to the starting line.

The license tests this time around are just challenges, there are no licenses in this version. You can go through all the tests to prove you can drive, prove you can brake at speed and prove you know how to corner but then all you have left to do is collect cars and beat your own times. The career mode has been replaced by single races which allow you to gain some more in-game currency to buy another car for some pretty much pointless racing. It just feels so meaningless.

The time trials hold little interest since you are only beating your own times. There is nothing really to strive towards, there seems to be very little purpose. It might not be so bad if they incorporated an online element but that seems to be missing too.

» Go to dav2612's original post
I'm playing Assassin's Creed Brotherhood at the moment, and I could reel off bad things they chose to do with that game for pages. Like, why have interact with people on 'Y' and interact with signs on 'B', yet multiple functions are assigned to all of the other buttons. Why force me to do a task slowly when I'm clearly too good for your constraints? Why give me a load screen for a cut scene I want to skip anyway? Why force me through nearly a whole chapter near the end, with broken armour, no health packs, and no way of fixing either?

ACB isn't as bad as a lot of the games that I've played recently - including the popular ones that everyone raves about - but there are so many tiny decisions in the ACB development process that went the wrong way. The core mechanics need reworking, because they just got to stratospheric levels of convolution.

And don't get me started on GT5. Good lord.
Posted 8:13pm on Mon 24 January 2011
Mr_Ninjutsu
  • Posts: 8,195
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In response to Woffls's
I'm playing Assassin's Creed Brotherhood at the moment, and I could reel off bad things they chose to do with that game for pages. Like, why have interact with people on 'Y' and interact with signs on 'B', yet multiple functions are assigned to all of the other buttons. Why force me to do a task slowly when I'm clearly too good for your constraints? Why give me a load screen for a cut scene I want to skip anyway? Why force me through nearly a whole chapter near the end, with broken armour, no health packs, and no way of fixing either?

ACB isn't as bad as a lot of the games that I've played recently - including the popular ones that everyone raves about - but there are so many tiny decisions in the ACB development process that went the wrong way. The core mechanics need reworking, because they just got to stratospheric levels of convolution.

And don't get me started on GT5. Good lord.

» Go to Woffls's original post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woffls
but there are so many tiny decisions in the ACB development process that went the wrong way. The core mechanics need reworking, because they just got to stratospheric levels of convolution.

Care to expand? Tiny decisions in the ACB development process? What were you working on that game or something? I don't think complaining about button layout is even worth mentioning, now if it was something more serious like an actual design choice, as in a fighting mechanic then sure.

For Mass Effect 2, i think that the planetry exploration for resources or 'mining' is pretty cool, most people from what i understand, dislike the idea very much and see it as pointless. If anything it's keeping inline with the sci-fi feel of the game and i wouldn't prefer it any other way. Interesting indeed.
Posted 9:20pm on Mon 24 January 2011
Woffls
  • Posts: 8,045
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In response to Topic
Interesting Design Choices. Also know as What the Feck We You Thinking?

We must all, at some point, come across something in a game which makes you wonder how it made it past the design stage. Some decisions you can't even begin to understand how anyone could have ever thought it might be a good idea.

From playing Enslaved last week I see that checkpoints before unskippable cutscenes are somehow still kicking about despite years of complaints.

But my clear winner is Gran Turismo on the PSP. The design of this game is simply baffling.

Like Gran Tursimo 5, the PSP game was hardly a rush job but somehow they forgot to actually include the game. It's more like a an interactive tool for car collecting.

The familiar tracks are present, the cars are all present, the challenges are all present, it plays and controls like a Gran Turismo game should but the career mode stalled and didn't make it to the starting line.

The license tests this time around are just challenges, there are no licenses in this version. You can go through all the tests to prove you can drive, prove you can brake at speed and prove you know how to corner but then all you have left to do is collect cars and beat your own times. The career mode has been replaced by single races which allow you to gain some more in-game currency to buy another car for some pretty much pointless racing. It just feels so meaningless.

The time trials hold little interest since you are only beating your own times. There is nothing really to strive towards, there seems to be very little purpose. It might not be so bad if they incorporated an online element but that seems to be missing too.

» Go to dav2612's original post
I don't need to have worked on a game to see where they made bad decisions.

What you call 'Button layout', is a design choice. Are you telling me that you can put any command on any button at random, and have it work perfectly? It's a design choice because when I'm given a dozen different functions at any one time, and rapidly changing in-game variables, I need to be in control. It has progressively become more of an issue in each iteration as Ubisoft Montreal added functionality, and ACB just crosses the line of unmanageable.

The fighting mechanic is executed through controls, therefore if the controls are bad, so is the fighting. I can execute 10 dudes in a row? That's great, but in the time between me lining up the attack and hitting them, they can hit me and stop it with no warning? When I can execute someone seems utterly random in crowded fights, and guns just ruin it completely. I take it you've played all the Assassin's Creed games and know what I'm getting at?

And the Mass Effect 2 resource mining is a bad design choice because it replaces actually going to the planet and exploring. Not in line with the Mass Effect universe at all, which I assume you played?
Posted 9:38pm on Mon 24 January 2011
Mr_Ninjutsu
  • Posts: 8,195
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In response to Woffls's
I don't need to have worked on a game to see where they made bad decisions.

What you call 'Button layout', is a design choice. Are you telling me that you can put any command on any button at random, and have it work perfectly? It's a design choice because when I'm given a dozen different functions at any one time, and rapidly changing in-game variables, I need to be in control. It has progressively become more of an issue in each iteration as Ubisoft Montreal added functionality, and ACB just crosses the line of unmanageable.

The fighting mechanic is executed through controls, therefore if the controls are bad, so is the fighting. I can execute 10 dudes in a row? That's great, but in the time between me lining up the attack and hitting them, they can hit me and stop it with no warning? When I can execute someone seems utterly random in crowded fights, and guns just ruin it completely. I take it you've played all the Assassin's Creed games and know what I'm getting at?

And the Mass Effect 2 resource mining is a bad design choice because it replaces actually going to the planet and exploring. Not in line with the Mass Effect universe at all, which I assume you played?

» Go to Woffls's original post
Well i suggest you word it so it doesn't seem as if you have done. Which i know you haven't.

But yeah button layout/mapping. Don't try and be condescending because it's not working for you. I said, it wasn't worth mentioning for your reasons for complaint. I personally believe that the button mapping is perfect for the game and i incurred no faults with it and i really do not believe any other person has, unless they have one hand. There's a thing called focus testing that sorts these little niggles out that seem to be stressing you out.

And i disagree, the fighting can be great but the controls lack in, how do you say? Finesse or refinement? Yeah i have played all the Assassins' Creed games, however, finding Brotherhood to be the most enjoyable in terms of gameplay (including fighting) and story. There really isn't any fighting issues with Brotherhood as there was with ACII and ACI.

Yeah i'm playing through Mass Effect 2 now...if people think it's a right effort in scanning planets then they will die if they have to scour the planet on foot. It's just a means of retrieving materials to gain more technologicaly advanced weaponry/armour etc. But the only gripe i have at the moment with ME2 is that there is more talking then there is action. That may change once i delve deeper into the game.
Posted 10:36pm on Mon 24 January 2011
Woffls
  • Posts: 8,045
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In response to Topic
Interesting Design Choices. Also know as What the Feck We You Thinking?

We must all, at some point, come across something in a game which makes you wonder how it made it past the design stage. Some decisions you can't even begin to understand how anyone could have ever thought it might be a good idea.

From playing Enslaved last week I see that checkpoints before unskippable cutscenes are somehow still kicking about despite years of complaints.

But my clear winner is Gran Turismo on the PSP. The design of this game is simply baffling.

Like Gran Tursimo 5, the PSP game was hardly a rush job but somehow they forgot to actually include the game. It's more like a an interactive tool for car collecting.

The familiar tracks are present, the cars are all present, the challenges are all present, it plays and controls like a Gran Turismo game should but the career mode stalled and didn't make it to the starting line.

The license tests this time around are just challenges, there are no licenses in this version. You can go through all the tests to prove you can drive, prove you can brake at speed and prove you know how to corner but then all you have left to do is collect cars and beat your own times. The career mode has been replaced by single races which allow you to gain some more in-game currency to buy another car for some pretty much pointless racing. It just feels so meaningless.

The time trials hold little interest since you are only beating your own times. There is nothing really to strive towards, there seems to be very little purpose. It might not be so bad if they incorporated an online element but that seems to be missing too.

» Go to dav2612's original post
The design decisions were made in the development process - this is not insider knowledge, this is common sense. My wording was fine. How you choose to interpret it is nothing to do with me.

It's fine that you disagree, and I expected people to do so, but don't tell me that my complaints aren't "worth mentioning". I find it interesting that you seem to be implying that focus testing automatically prevents games from having problems.

And if you think there's too much talking and not enough action in Mass Effect 2, don't bother with the first one. It's probably not your cup of tea.
Posted 12:02am on Tue 25 January 2011
Mr_Ninjutsu
  • Posts: 8,195
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In response to Woffls's
The design decisions were made in the development process - this is not insider knowledge, this is common sense. My wording was fine. How you choose to interpret it is nothing to do with me.

It's fine that you disagree, and I expected people to do so, but don't tell me that my complaints aren't "worth mentioning". I find it interesting that you seem to be implying that focus testing automatically prevents games from having problems.

And if you think there's too much talking and not enough action in Mass Effect 2, don't bother with the first one. It's probably not your cup of tea.

» Go to Woffls's original post
Can you not post something without being patronizing? It's almost like you involuntary claim this 'get off your high horse' embodiment of yourself. But that just may be the way you express your opinion?

Yeah I feel like it wasn't worth mentioning as it's something petty, in my opinion that is. Which i'm entitled to, just as much as you are. But pointless nonetheless, and comments like...

Quote:
Why give me a load screen for a cut scene I want to skip anyway?

...Is rather pointless, again as it's a cutscene, it has to be loaded one way or another. Are you THAT pathetic that you're fussed over something like that?! Like honestly? It's laughable. That's not a design choice, unless of course it's a key point in the story that gives valuable information, then yeah it is and is understandable. And should be respected in that sense.

Like i said, i've yet to really get into the game of Mass Effect 2. So chill on the front.
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